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Post by jrtheoriginal on Nov 27, 2011 11:56:31 GMT -5
What do you guys want in the new dairy bill? I listed some stuff over at AW but I know you guys can't read all of it so I want your opinions as well.
EVEN GLo's! LOL
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Post by glowplug on Nov 27, 2011 13:50:35 GMT -5
You want an opinion......well the Packers are the very best. There's an opinion.
Anyhoooo, I'd love to see milk priced as milk, no classes of milk.
End the make allowances. End volume premiums. Enhance quality and component premiums. I had Holsteins but the higher component breeds should get their due.
Remove cheese from the commodities priced on the CME. It's b.s. to price milk based upon one kind of cheese very lightly traded. Too easily manipulated.
Tariff the heck out of foreign dairy imports. Don't need their chit quality coming in here.
So there's some opinions that come to mind. I'll sit back and watch you titty tuggers post.
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Post by linsal on Nov 27, 2011 17:10:30 GMT -5
End volume premiums and make allowances. Make it illegal to have anything going into cheese vats other than milk (e.g., sodium gluconate, unregulated imported dairy proteins, plant based starches used as fillers, etc.).
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Post by pldairy on Nov 27, 2011 20:19:11 GMT -5
End volume premiums and make allowances. Make it illegal to have anything going into cheese vats other than milk (e.g., sodium gluconate, unregulated imported dairy proteins, plant based starches used as fillers, etc.). I am with you on this!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! >:(its time we take back our foods
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Post by bentover on Nov 28, 2011 8:45:56 GMT -5
I am not against volume premiums. All milk processors should be able to price there milk differently for bigger producers. Lets say a producer brings in 4 tankers a day. They only need 4 samples taken and tested for components and drugs. They only have to do the bookwork for one producer as compared to 20 producers who deliver 10,000# of milk a day. I think those big producers shouldf be able to deliver milk on the spot market' or to any processesor they want to unless their milk is contracted . Even smaller producers get some volume premium. It is about the only way processors can attract bigger farms. The privates or Co-ops have a right to offer different prices to attract bigger producersj just like any smaller farmers will seek the highest prices they can get ITS FREE ENTERPRISE
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Post by glowplug on Nov 28, 2011 9:17:45 GMT -5
You make good points bent, but the price paid in volume premiums far exceeds the lower testing and book-keeping costs. I wouldn't have a problem in giving the larger producer credit for those costs.
But a hwt of the milk I shipped had the same cheese yield as a hwt of anyone else's milk (assuming same components, etc.) The cheese factory doesn't get a higher cheese yield from the guy who ships a whole tanker, than they get if it takes 20 guys to fill a tanker (again components, etc. must be equal).
What I experienced with my former co-op was they reduced quality premiums to give the fieldmen some walking around money to go hunting for the larger dairymen. Not exactly in keeping with co-op principles, bent. This is where you and I part ways in opinion. The co-op should value the smaller scale member just like the larger scale producer. (And that was one of several reasons I left the co-op to ship to a private owned cheesemaker.) About 6 years later, that co-op was bought out by Saputo, in part because so many long-loyal members left. Playing the volume premium game bit them in the butt.
There's no reason cheese plants can't compete on quality premiums, bent. Lower SCC does increase cheese yield. That adds value to the process and end product. I'll agree that some compensation for fewer samples and less bookkeeping also has value. But in this era of computers, bookkeeping is pretty streamlined.
Just my 2 cents.
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Post by glowplug on Nov 28, 2011 9:18:10 GMT -5
You make good points bent, but the price paid in volume premiums far exceeds the lower testing and book-keeping costs. I wouldn't have a problem in giving the larger producer credit for those costs.
But a hwt of the milk I shipped had the same cheese yield as a hwt of anyone else's milk (assuming same components, etc.) The cheese factory doesn't get a higher cheese yield from the guy who ships a whole tanker, than they get if it takes 20 guys to fill a tanker (again components, etc. must be equal).
What I experienced with my former co-op was they reduced quality premiums to give the fieldmen some walking around money to go hunting for the larger dairymen. Not exactly in keeping with co-op principles, bent. This is where you and I part ways in opinion. The co-op should value the smaller scale member just like the larger scale producer. (And that was one of several reasons I left the co-op to ship to a private owned cheesemaker.) About 6 years later, that co-op was bought out by Saputo, in part because so many long-loyal members left. Playing the volume premium game bit them in the butt.
There's no reason cheese plants can't compete on quality premiums, bent. Lower SCC does increase cheese yield. That adds value to the process and end product. I'll agree that some compensation for fewer samples and less bookkeeping also has value. But in this era of computers, bookkeeping is pretty streamlined.
Just my 2 cents.
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Post by bentover on Nov 28, 2011 9:35:35 GMT -5
I know co-ops are supposed to be true communism everyone is treated equally. But in reality some are more equal. I have never been a co-op fan whether purchasing or selling I never sold to any dairy co-op too many bad farmers whose milk quality was way below standards but the co-op buys everything if you were a co-op member
The co-ops will always need to offer higher prices or bigger premiums to the BTO's because the privates will offer more and the co-ops have to match or beat the private's prices. There is no value in waiting for co-op benefits so they need to match the prices paid by the privates or loose the producer.
I also believe that the risks of tainted milk is much lower from big producers with top end parlors that identify cows who are treated or sick. Milk processors can't aford lose tankers or silos of milk to drug residue
My opinion is worth a nickel The dollar is down a lot today
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Post by glowplug on Nov 28, 2011 10:01:00 GMT -5
Good thoughts, maybe worth 7 cents? obamunist inflation, ya know. Hmmmm, not sure how many tankers of "hot" milk are dumped these days. I know that I always sent in a sample to confirm that a formerly treated cow was cleared up before tanking her milk. Guess I believe that over time, the bad actors have been weeded out by economics. Anyhoooo, milk doesn't end up in the factory silo until it passes the test. But no farmer will survive very long if he buys that tanker of hot milk. My take on co-ops is not pure communism. The guys shipping higher quality and better components should be better compensated because they make the plant more profitable for all. Yup USA mentality is to make lots of stuff. We won WW2 because we mass produced a lot of stuff, more stuff than the Germans and Japs could make. But our stuff was lower quality. The German Panzer was superior to the US Sherman. In fact, our Sherman tanks were death traps for our soldiers. But we cranked out stuff. Germans had better rifles, better planes (even jets before we did), etc. Pizzes me off that this mentality is applied to cheese making. WI has the best cheeses, but even some WI vats get "filler" from NZ added because we want to make "cheap" stuff. CA cheeses are just about all made with NZ MPC filler and those cheeses give all cheese a bad name. We're doing to cheese what Bud and Miller did to beers. Mass produced "stuff" that any German beer drinker would laugh at. Hmmmm, I want a 17 cent volume premium for my comment........
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Post by kwestfarms on Nov 28, 2011 11:18:01 GMT -5
High volume premiums are as much a fact of business practise today and will be tomorrow...IMO... as are discounted prices for high volume purchases (fertilizer , seed , soy or cottenseed,etc. ) Sell by the semi-load , receive more ; buy by semi-load pay less. Co-op or private... makes no difference!!! John
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Post by bentover on Nov 28, 2011 14:06:35 GMT -5
Give John a Quarter. Good reply there Kwest. He posted a very concise honest opinion of marketing facts.
Gp with all your posts you are flooding the market.. Take a price deduction LOL
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Post by jrtheoriginal on Nov 28, 2011 14:45:55 GMT -5
High volume premiums are as much a fact of business practise today and will be tomorrow...IMO... as are discounted prices for high volume purchases (fertilizer , seed , soy or cottenseed,etc. ) Sell by the semi-load , receive more ; buy by semi-load pay less. Co-op or private... makes no difference!!! John AAHHH but you miss the point the processor isn't paying the premium the producers of the CO-OP are! That means they take all the money that comes into the CO-OP for the month and then deduct the volume premiums and SCC premiums and the other various premiums from the gross And what is left magically becomes the "pay price" so it is a take from the littlest and give to the biggest scheme! This is not a business that should pay for convenience by taking from some to give to others! Besides along time ago I realized that co-ops are more like GOV. than private business. So it makes a huge difference!
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Post by kwestfarms on Nov 28, 2011 18:09:43 GMT -5
jr : You are right , gov'nt and co-ops alike. Big farmers have received the most from government programs and are treated the same way by the co-ops , no argument there!! Check the AWG website and you will see large farmers receive the lions share of money paid out in govn't ag programs. Makes sense , payments based on acres farmed , big farmers farm more land!! Like it or not co-ops operate the same !! John
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Post by glowplug on Nov 28, 2011 19:26:42 GMT -5
What happened to the co-ops was the BTO has employees so he has time to serve on the board or his dad does. So the co-op boards got dominated by the big players.
Now again, what brings value to the business side of the co-op cheese plant? A tanker load of higher SCC milk from one farm or a tanker load of quality milk from 20 farms with a greater cheese yield? Well in the end, it is all blended together. The worst stuff is brought up to average by dilluting it with the quality stuff. And quality stuff is dragged down to average, dilluted with the worst stuff.
End resut = the cheese may not taste as good as it should and the consumer buys less of it.
Now, I'm not saying that all small farmers produce quality nor that all large dairies produce poor quality. A study some years ago showed that WI milk quality was better than CA dairies quality. Not sure what it is at today.
I believe the co-ops should pay on what makes them more profitable. It would seem that quality milk does but American culture seems geared towards favoring quantity over quality.
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dman
FFA member
Posts: 63
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Post by dman on Nov 28, 2011 22:47:03 GMT -5
Well fellers, volume premiums come from the same pot of money as "pay price". So if a co-op doesn't pay volume premiums to the few, there is more money in the pot for all. Hmmmm, the RAF fighter pilots come to mind here....you know the ones Churchill said this about "never have so few given so much for so many." Same could be said for volume premiums. IF those who got them, gave them up, then EVERYBODY would get a higher price. And using the argument that co-ops/private plants NEED volume premiums to get enough milk and they are part of business......welllllllllllllll. if they need milk so bad why DON'T THEY PAY MORE FOR IT? What a concept! I found a small co-op here in MN or rather they found me, but will be start shipping to them on Jan. 1. They are a cheese plant, they typically pay OVER the FMMO minimums for PROT and SCC. They only pay volume in July, Aug, Sept, and Oct., and only on lbs of prot over 3 lbs/cwt. So everyone has the same volume premium. They have BTO's already, and they are just moving into this area to procure milk, and several BTO who currently getting a volume premium are switching also. Why? Becasue even without the volume premium they are $.30-.40/cwt ahead of their current co-op/processor. Again someone PAYING MORE for milk instead of just using premiums to get your milk.....wad a concept!!!
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